Road Racing is like Crack Options

[Kazz5]

Hell yesss!!

Bring out your truck and play!

[awd4kicks]

Kicks, the only thing you wrote I disagree with is that I think you can still be a "car guy" and run around is a close to stock car. People got to start somewhere and if your using (abusing) your car the way God intended, I'd classifiy that person as a car guy.

Chris, I respect your input...you were out at the track more than any other local DSM owner this year.

At the same time you gotta know I am not putting down 'Car guys' that can't afford or choose not to do certain upgrades to their ride as long as they are willing to walk the talk.

The guys that ARE frustrating me are the ones that talk the big game with guys that have put a ton of blood sweat and tears into this hobby, but don't intend to indulge themselves. The guys that just want to be seen in a group they think is cool. The fags that can't handle life by themselves without latching on to someone else's party. (A little over the top, maybe) But I'm not taking a back seat to any POSER!

I won't call them out in the middle of a get together. That's not my way. It's in the racing and it's in the details of the ride. We all can tell the difference between someone that is really interested versus the motor mouth wanna-be.

The point is, the ratio of posers to real true car guy lifers is pretty lop sided in the wrong direction. I'm saying any DSM with an EVOIII 16g and some supporting mods can be king shit in a group at any one time. There are big dogs out there, and a true DSM'r will recognize them and respect their lot in the car arena.

It's all good under the hood, as long as we are out there living our dreams and taking our spot in the pole position of life.

It's time to stop preach'n and start teach'n!

[natedogg]

Hell yesss!!   

Bring out your truck and play!

I think I'd rather bring out my Talon and play.

[Kazz5]

Hell yesss!!   

Bring out your truck and play!

I think I'd rather bring out my Talon and play.

It's road course worthy! C'mon!

[natedogg]

I'd have to run a more lightly sprung WG actuator. I'm running a vac line straight from the turbo nipple to the WG actuator right now and still boosting past 30 psi.

[Hornswoggler]

marcus, glad to see the motivational post! Hopefully it gets a few more ppl convinced to get that neverending project back in road-worthy shape, and out to some events!

I am really not sure who you are talking about who does not "walk the talk". I figured it wasn't me, since I am pretty darn active... figured it wasn't the cat car guys (not even an official group) as 80%+ of them partake in sanctioned motorsports, couldn't be from the cicenet Old Chicago meeting... as well over 60% of them do either autocross, track days, wheel-2-wheel racing, or drag racing.

By process of elimination, are you referring to DSM central as the ones who need to do more driving, less yacking? Why didn't we get any DSMCentral bites for the Putnam event the "cat car guys" went to back in October? Seems like all I hear from DSM guys is the worry their car might not make it, and they need a trailer as there is great chance it will break. I would like to see some DSM road course reliability next year so my opinon of them can be raised.

I'll take the guess you were talking about CSS, and I probably would have to agree with you, lol!

I disagree that street racing is the solution. Nothing wrong with the occasional fun when the coast is clear, but its like a trickle of water at best compared to the Fire Hose spy got to drink from at Putnam. There is really no comparison, and highway/street racing really isn't that much higher in the pyramid than the BS'ers (which I am still not sure who you are referring to).

The automotive hobby means different things to different people. I prefer the driving, while others do it for the wrenching, the building, the fixing, the dreaming, the car shows, the bragging rights, etc. I think the diversity is what makes the BS more fun... I enjoy hearing about different approaches or ways to enjoy your car.

From your posts, it sounds like you have somebody or some group specifically in mind with your call-out. Maybe you can PM me who that is so your posts in this thread are less confusing? lol. I REALLY hope to see some of you DSM guys make it out to the road course next year... and if you want to be king shit for the day, I can always hook you up with the traqmate for a session and see if you can spanky my laptimes.

[wortdog]

By process of elimination, are you referring to DSM central as the ones who need to do more driving, less yacking? Why didn't we get any DSMCentral bites for the Putnam event the "cat car guys" went to back in October? Seems like all I hear from DSM guys is the worry their car might not make it, and they need a trailer as there is great chance it will break. I would like to see some DSM road course reliability next year so my opinon of them can be raised.

Well, my DSM didn't make it because it burnt down

[Hornswoggler]

Well, my DSM didn't make it because it burnt down

Definately a legit excuse!

Did i hear you were already working on a replacement project? If so, looking forward to hearing about it!

[awd4kicks]

...and if you want to be king shit for the day, I can always hook you up with the traqmate for a session and see if you can spanky my laptimes.

I would love to take you up on that Horn Swallower. J/K
Seriously, I like you Horns, but don't be surprised if I creep up on your lap times after an event or two.

No I wasn't referring to you about walking the talk, but I was refering to your personal opinion that people that have not been to a road corse are completely clueless about real driving. Maybe I've read too much into it, but to me driving levels are just that. Levels of a whole ability. Some people have it and some don't. Have you ever ridden with spy on the street? Sure it may be a few seconds of bliss here and there, but its as ragged edge as I would go on any state maintained (read crapy) road. On the way to the CICE net gathering I folowed RoadRacerWhite around an on/off ramp at rediculous speeds. The Talon had the rear end angled out a bit just try to keep pace with the speed that his trained skill allowed him to carry. Again, not a lot of time, but not all together clueless either.

I have wanted to road race all of my life, but for some reason I haven't made that a priority. When I began to auto-cross the old timers told me not to worry with road racing because auto-cross is much more technically challenging. I gather that they are right, but that there is some rift, weather amusing or not, between the road racers and auto-crossers. In any case I love all styles/levels of driving as long as it is challenging.

[awd4kicks]

Cool, I had been considering that myself.

[awd4kicks]

Yes it's going over well so far. I've been deemed the 'Tool' and compared to Image already. yeah, we are exactly a like. Funny!

[awd4kicks]

Yeah. I guess I am just like him.

[awd4kicks]

hA HA HA HA... Good one Spy!

[Hornswoggler]

It doesn't have to be a roadcourse to gain disciplined car control skills.. with either some auto-x schools or LOTS of auto-x seat time, you can build a very similar skillset. Both HPDE (High performance drivers education, I won't use the term "racing", as these are non-competitive events designed around learning) and auto-x have their pros/cons with much overlap. If you want a real impression of how they compare, be sure and talk to somebody who has done both. I have my preference and have always had respect for the driving skills for those who are very good at auto-x.

If all somebody has done is spirited street driving on their own, I will say that 98% of those drivers will be absolutely humbled at their first couple auto-x or HPDE's as they might be getting passed by much slower cars. Spy might have been in the other 2%, lol! Then again, with more practice and maybe a lil chassis tuning, he can close that 4 second gap to the stock-power SRT-4 on street tires. Power isn't everything and it takes a performance driving experience to realize this. Spy, how accurate would you say my statement is saying that spirited street driving and HPDE are at two different levels? I think there is a pretty big gap, especially once you climb the ranks into intermediate and advanced run groups, its just not safe to consistently push those levels without run-off room and safety equipment.

I agree, some people may have the talent, and others not so much... with a lot of people falling "in between". Take sports for example, it is always a mix between natural talent and disciplined practice. With enough of one, you can usually overcome the other... but to be at the highest level, you need a lot of BOTH!

I have no idea your auto-x experience, my earlier comparison is between street-only drivers who think they have mastered driving, and those with disciplined driving education. Big gap there. Auto-x school would count as driving education, i did not mean to leave them out in my initial statement.

Either way, the smack talk is fun and I think we can have a good time with it. It does bring publicity to these type of events (auto-x, hpde, etc) and gets some good conversation going. Looking forward to seeing a few of you at the track next year, and if there is anything I can do to help you beat my laptimes, I would be thrilled! (i.e. in-car instructing, preparing for first event, data analysis, etc.). This is a fun hobby and I want to see everybody get the most from it.

[Shaun@AMS]

We will see how the Stang goes over the winter.

In the mean time I'm getting very bored with talking about cars and finding that there are a lot of folks out there that don't walk the talk. DSM owners have always been a do or die breed making a lot out of very little. I would like to see the members of DSMCentral stand back-up and be accounted for.

Aside from the fact that there are more GENERALIZED car forums to get caught up in, DSMCentral is still here.

Who want's to race? I'm willing. To hell with breaking shit! I've been sitting in the background with a 500 plus HP engine under the hood and more upgrade parts to handle it than I can even count... watching and listening as local fellas talk about their close to stock sports and street cars and call themselves 'Car guys'. BAHHH! (Edit: This is NOT a poke at the Cat 'Car Guy' list...this is a generalization to keep me from picking on any one person. GET OVER IT!)

Well the facade is over, we can sit around bull shitting all the time or we can get in our damn cars, race them and let the chips of respect fall where they may. Networking is great if it gets us to our purpose, but it is not supposed to be the end result.

THAT'S RACING for me! On the drag strip, the auto-x, the road corse or even from light to light or a round an off ramp. Yes, I know that our fun loving, spirited driving is under attack from all sides. I'm keenly aware of the high and mighty scrutiny of so called 'Professional drivers' that are discounting street driving aptitude. Screw that load of horse shit, racing is racing if you don't want to do it fine, I just don't want to hear any lame ass excuses.

I want to kick some panzy butt... and for the record that is most of whats out there. (BTW - I didn't say 'All' to any nut swinger that wants to go running to a friend that actually has a fast car and tell them I hurt your feelings.)

These are the late night rantings of the ODT! And Kiss my Ass, I haven't been drinking.

im sure i can find a car for you to get down with.............

[Hornswoggler]

Spy, I am not trying to pick on your times at all nor trying to put you on the defensive. I used your example for a couple points: (and I use you because most here can relate or most familiar with you and your setups)

1. Adding horsepower does not solve everything around road course
2. The way to overcome this gap is chassis tuning (which includes both suspension, brakes, and even tires) and more practice could EASILY put you at par or ahead. This supports point #1.

your TA + suspension, brakes, tires, and seattime should be able to crush all SRT-4 challengers. Joe is a great driver, so it will definately take some work, but not out of scope.

... now a very well setup evo should be able to leave me in the dust.

edit: I know I have mentioned this before, but its worth mentioning again, for a first time event, you were looking VERY impressive out there! Definately a step or two above most others in your run group.

[awd4kicks]

It's a legitimate point Horns, and maybe it's just me because I cross train my car. But I don't think too many DSM folks do power only. For me I set it up as good as I can afford on all fronts. this means it wont be the best at anything, but it should hold it's own on everything.

AS far as my comments about Spy pushing the limits. In all cases I was referring to the EVO not the TA. There IS a huge platform difference there.

Still it's all good, just a clarification and point that makes the SRT-4 comparison less of a factor.

[Hornswoggler]

Nothing but respect, the smack talk is both fun and motivational.

we'll definately have to bump this one come spring. I'll try my best to promote next slo pny on cicenet, hope we can get quite a few to show there.

2008 will be the year of the driving.

[awd4kicks]

I agree Horns! Thanks for the future support of the drag events!