Last Saturday I put a clutch in for a realatively new member of the board, and someone who admitted to me that they were not mechanicaly savy. I charged a very resonable fee and installed the clutch in a day. Car is a 98 GSX, clutch was a ACT 2100 with a fidenza flywheel and ACT throwout bearing. Tranny was filled with Penzoil syncromesh. I discoverd a leaky clutch master cylinder when the clutch pedal stuck to the floor. Resivoir was found to be empty when I opened it, so the system was filled and bled.

Those of you that know me I hope will vouch for my abilities at being qualified to put these items into this car. Problems have now arrisen that I belive are unrelated to the clutch, and I am being blamed for them. I don't take lightly to this sort of thing. I think my record is pretty spotless, I'd like to keep it that way.

Customer is now complaining of a vibration that seems to come from the rear of the car. Also is making a noise such that he can't hear the radio over it. Also complains of leaking fluid, pretty sure it's tranny fluid.

I attributed the vibration and noise to the light flywheel and the ACT throwout bearing. I don't understand why the noise would be this loud, but I haven't heard it myself either. Bearing was lubed prior to installation. Customer has replaced the master and slave cylinders. I attributed the leak at first to possibly some fluid I forgot to wipe up, but after stating that it has continued, I suggest that it's possibly a axle seal that went bad after pulling the axles. They have stated that they are going to have to take the car to the dealer to have this fixed now for $600+, which I think is a total rip-off.

Am I totally off base here? I'm afraid that this person is, in part, having too high of expectations for a 9 year old modified car. I'd like to see him save the $600 for something more usefull. I'd invite this person to let me take a look at the car, possibly with another qualified member of the board, so we can get this worked out so that everyone is happy. I don't expect this person to reply, but I hope that they read to understand that I'm not out to get anyone.

I did a clutch job on my gsx one time and discovered I had a leaky half-shaft seal after it was all buttoned up. It happens unfortunately.

I agree with Spy.

It's kind of iffy with the whole axle seal. I for one am not one who did not do a whole lot of stuff with axle seals. i guess i was fortunate mine didn't leak when I changed my half shafts.

On the one hand, you did the work, and suggesting the axle seals be replaced wouldn't have been a bad idea to recommend this. His ignorance to knowing to replace doesn't help. But, how often do they go bad?

On the other hand, he asked you to do a job and you did. Then, you spotted a problem and fixed that (the clutch master cylinder).

If I was in his shoes I wouldn't be happy. My car isn't running properly, at which my friends would tell me that this is what you get with an old car, especially if you try to alter your daily driver or make it into a race car. Stuff will break. Let's also think this through: if I just got a new clutch put into my gsx, i would probably try a few of those revered about high rpm launches. After it left your hands, you can't garauntee the use of the AFTERMARKET parts on the car.

All in all, it sucks, but I don't think you're at fault. You could always donate your time to HELP him replace the seals, but that's as gracious as I would be. Then he gets exposed to some of the inner workings of the car.

Just my .02

And now you realize the pitfall of working in/owning a shop....

Regardless, I've known and trusted you for quite a long time. You've never led me on, lied to me, or screwed me, and we've done multiple business dealings. I don't see why you would start now. Sounds like the kid probably had problems with his car, you fixed the ones he knew about, and then he realized he had more, and is trying to blame it on you. Sucks, but tis life.

I can vouch you are the type of guy to go out of his way to make it right. So I'm sure it'll get taken care of one way or another.

I can't imagine anybody having a problem with Rob as he's always been a go-to guy for needs with parts and assistance for many of us.

Bottom line here is that parts fail on DSM's, particularly when they're modified, and particularly when you're getting in there and replacing other parts. Similar situation would be replacing ball joints and the tie rod ends go out. Happens all the time.

Sure, hindsight is 20/20 and it's easy to see now that the seals would have been a good idea but a trans job is no small task and it's often difficult enough to ensure that all the parts that are _directly_ relevant are sure to be included when the car is dropped off at the shop for work. And as we all know, there are a million 'while you're at it' type things that can come into play. Who is to say that he shouldn't have suggested popping off the oil pan and inspecting the bearings since he already had the t-case and possibly the downpipe off the car? Or performing the t-case yolk seal fix and filling the carrier bushings with window weld while the car saw some downtime.

The buck has to stop at some point and I think AWD already demonstrated that he went beyond the scope of the original work by handling the clutch hydraulics issue when it arose.

^^^^

very well said

I've also had several business dealings with Rob, and I've always been more than happy with his ethics. Always going out of his way to give you a little bit more for free.

what goat said^^^

Rob is "THE MAN". Enough said.

I've had several dealings with him, never a bad transaction. He's also worked on my car quite a bit, never a problem. He even did some stuff that he didn't have to do but did it anyway (ehhhem emissions elimination). I see no reason the rear end should vibrate after a clutch install nor should he be leaking fluid because you reinstalled the trans. Seals go bad and parts break. I know this as I've replaced just about every single drivetrain part there is on my car at least once.

I will gladly stand in the fire for Rob.

And I will gladly buy you a drink if you actually do stand in a fire for Rob. triple-dare-ya!

Herrick for PREZ!

I agree with everyone else. Rob has always been known to stand by his work and these problems sound unrelated to a clutch job.

Axle seals going bad is a common problem and it doesn't always coincide with removal and installation of half shafts. It can happen anytime.

If this person chose to use the ACT TO bearing instead of an OEM one that is this person's fault. We have had threads on here and there are plenty on other sites that recommend only using the OEM TO bearing for quiet clutch operation. Like Rob said a lightened flywheel is also cause for more drivetrain noise because the lighter the flywheel, the less vibration/noise dampening. Maybe he's just being a little too sensitive.

Thanks guys. It's almost making me teary eyed to read this now...


I said almost.

I will vouch for Rob as a good honest guy. That should go without saying.

This kind of problem is so comon it's not even funny! I have spent more time discussing these magically appearing problems in the automotive business for the past two years. I've found there are four basic kinds of customers.

-The quiet customer that just wants what he asks for and no more
-Those that totally trust your work and are understanding of mechanical issues that have come up before hand and those that come up after the fact.
-Those that are willing to do some work but have been burned and are always a bit reluctant.
-Then there is always a few customers that you can count on to find something wrong. No matter how simple or remote there will be a huge deal that seems to be the end of the world regardless of the situation.

Problems do occur and if Rob is willing to check them out to make them right then it's a no brainer.

I swear, the thirteen people that posted in this thread are like the DSMC Mafia.

(In a Tony Montoya voice) "Don't you talk to me lik dat! I'll send mine boys after chu!"

But in all seriousness, it seems that the majority of the members in this thread are all part of the tight knit web that is DSMCentral. If anybody ever has a problem, it's usually one of these guys who responds to help you out. It's nice, really really nice to have friends like you guys. Whether it's backing someone up or helping someone out, you guys are always there.

I'm reminded of Christopher Walkin in Joe Dirt.

"Whoa, whoa, whoa! You're talking to my guy all wrong! How 'bout I stab you in the face with a soldering iron!?!"

I also really appreciate the tightness with which we are all bound. I've seen more people stick up for others on this board than I've seen in most real life situations. I'm just so thankfull that I can be part of the beautiful relationship. Sniff sniff....

Goat... You just made my day. That's one of the funniest quotes I've ever seen.