 The TALON, Running Project Report |
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 Aug 8 2006, 07:00 PM
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#81
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 Post Master  Group: Members Posts: 780 Joined: 14-July 04 Member No.: 338  |
Such a nuissance can be remedied in a couple of ways, but electrical shielding would probably be the best idea in this case. I have a bunch of leftover shielding, so let me know if you want to explore this avenue. And perhaps even MY avenue...
-------------------- QUOTE (gsxracer80 @ Oct 31 2006, 12:41 AM)
thanks hcar.... I am still massaging that area trying to get it ready...  |
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Aug 9 2006, 11:41 AM
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#82
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DSMCentral Godfather Group: Admin Posts: 3,823 Joined: 10-January 01 From: Washburn Member No.: 26 |
Thanks Goat. I may take you up on that as soon as I get some of these other issues ironed out. That may get your blood pumping to finish breathing life into your monster.
-------------------- In Loving memory of David T Crebo
Greatness comes from the most unexpected places!  |
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Aug 9 2006, 12:57 PM
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#83
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 Post Master Group: Members Posts: 908 Joined: 7-October 03 From: Chillicothe, IL Member No.: 182 |
Hey kicks, give me a call and let me know how that chip worked out for you.
-------------------- GVR4 866/1000 = the perpetually broken car
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Aug 9 2006, 01:10 PM
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#84
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Post Master Group: Members Posts: 780 Joined: 14-July 04 Member No.: 338 |
QUOTE (awd4kicks @ Aug 9 2006, 11:41 AM) Thanks Goat. I may take you up on that as soon as I get some of these other issues ironed out. That may get your blood pumping to finish breathing life into your monster. There may be more life in that monster than anyone knows.... 
-------------------- QUOTE (gsxracer80 @ Oct 31 2006, 12:41 AM)
thanks hcar.... I am still massaging that area trying to get it ready... |
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Aug 11 2006, 04:56 PM
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#85
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DSMCentral Godfather Group: Admin Posts: 3,823 Joined: 10-January 01 From: Washburn Member No.: 26 |
Planning on loading the Talon up on R&T's dyno Saturday morning around 9:30am.
My primary goal will be to find the best cam gear timing for spool and midrange for WOT runs. So it will be a tedious dyno sesion and may not net very impressive numbers. Right now I will be happy if it breaks 400 ponies at the wheels with the plans I have in mind for tomorrow. She could barely pull away from Spy's 300 the other night so I don't expect too much. That said anyone is more than welcome to join. I hope to only be on the dyno for a couple of hours. I'm going to pull the T-case tonight so I don't have to waste time with it tomorrow. -------------------- In Loving memory of David T Crebo
Greatness comes from the most unexpected places! |
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Aug 11 2006, 07:46 PM
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#86
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DSMCentral Godfather Group: Admin Posts: 3,823 Joined: 10-January 01 From: Washburn Member No.: 26 |
Holy Sheep Ship!
Burning rubber through four gears at will is crazy!  The T-case and drive shaft are out. We are ready for the dyno tomorrow. -------------------- In Loving memory of David T Crebo
Greatness comes from the most unexpected places! |
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Aug 11 2006, 09:39 PM
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#87
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 Eats and sleeps DSM jargin. Group: Members Posts: 1,995 Joined: 27-November 04 From: Yates City IL Member No.: 389 |
If your going to be there for a couple of hours, maybe I run by with my son. I need to put some miles (and tuning) on the new Supra SMIC setup anyway.
-------------------- 92 Eagle Talon TSI AWD "The Black Golfball" How fast can a 14B go???
91 Chevy C1500 "Problem Child" **SOLD** 01 Impala DD 07 Trailblazer Wife's new DD Cars run on blood, sweat, and horsepower... Without the first two, you can't get the last" SOB Racing "Sitting On Blocks" |
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Aug 11 2006, 11:19 PM
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#88
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 Eats and sleeps DSM jargin. Group: Members Posts: 1,108 Joined: 2-October 05 From: Waverly, Illinois Member No.: 636 |
QUOTE (awd4kicks @ Aug 11 2006, 08:46 PM) Holy Sheep Ship! Burning rubber through four gears at will is crazy! The T-case and drive shaft are out. We are ready for the dyno tomorrow. OK I am not to smart on this dyno thing. If you take out the drive shaft and transfer case that leaves you with fwd. So if you say pull 500 fwhp is that the same as awdhp? Or does it loose hp adding the other two wheels? -------------------- Thanks, Bud!
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Aug 12 2006, 06:16 AM
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#89
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DSMCentral Godfather Group: Admin Posts: 3,823 Joined: 10-January 01 From: Washburn Member No.: 26 |
If I can keep the front tiresfrom spinning this will show a slightly higher HP than if I were on an AWD dyno since I wont have alot of the AWD's parasitic loss. For a base line and tuning purposes it will be fine. I will simply be comparing my baseline with improvements that I make on the same dyno.
-------------------- In Loving memory of David T Crebo
Greatness comes from the most unexpected places! |
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Aug 12 2006, 08:56 AM
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#90
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DSM Tech Wizard Group: Members Posts: 2,404 Joined: 16-December 03 From: Fletcher/Bloomington Member No.: 214 |
You've got a Viscous Coupling eliminator in though right? Without the VCE it'll smoke your stocker.
-------------------- "I hear he tunes the space shuttle also...and that thing is fast"
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Aug 12 2006, 02:18 PM
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#91
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DSMCentral Godfather Group: Admin Posts: 3,823 Joined: 10-January 01 From: Washburn Member No.: 26 |
Yup... without the VCE I would have to use an AWD Dyno.
We found the best cam configuration for the Talon today that produced the least amount of knock and the most HP/torque. Our first pull with the cams straight up netted 427HP & 437ft/lbs of torque. By the time we were done we got the HP up to 452 and the Torque number matched it. Considering I've been designing it for 500 WHP and I was not looking for peak HP today I am very happy with the numbers! BTW - That calculates out to approximately 520 crank HP. Good and bad...I'm not exactly sure where my boost was at. My gage read between 20 and 23psi through various pulls. I want to maximize boost on pump gas and I'm going to need better boost control and a gage to pin that down. I have been running Shell 93 octane for the past couple weeks which I have been slapped around for. With more boost, better 93 octane and maybe the use of water injection 500whp should be do-able. -------------------- In Loving memory of David T Crebo
Greatness comes from the most unexpected places! |
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Aug 12 2006, 02:44 PM
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#92
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Eats and sleeps DSM jargin. Group: Members Posts: 1,995 Joined: 27-November 04 From: Yates City IL Member No.: 389 |
The car sounded good man!
Looks like you tweaked the HP after I left, 450 lb of torque is insane from a 4 cylinder. I can't wait to see it run down the track.What's wrong with Shell 93?? What's a better brand to run? -------------------- 92 Eagle Talon TSI AWD "The Black Golfball" How fast can a 14B go???
91 Chevy C1500 "Problem Child" **SOLD** 01 Impala DD 07 Trailblazer Wife's new DD Cars run on blood, sweat, and horsepower... Without the first two, you can't get the last" SOB Racing "Sitting On Blocks" |
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Aug 12 2006, 04:19 PM
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#93
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 Eats and sleeps DSM jargin. Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 25-June 04 From: 61554 Member No.: 314 |
QUOTE (awd4kicks @ Aug 12 2006, 03:18 PM) I have been running Shell 93 octane for the past couple weeks which I have been slapped around for. With more boost, better 93 octane and maybe the use of water injection 500whp should be do-able. nate got on my for running shell 93 as well  nice numbers
-------------------- ┌∩┐(◣_◢)┌∩┐
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Aug 12 2006, 04:57 PM
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#94
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DSM Tech Wizard Group: Members Posts: 2,256 Joined: 10-January 01 From: central IL Member No.: 10 |
I've been running shell as well.... please fill us in!!!
Oh, and good numbers Marcus.... Maybe I should swap the 318 our for a 4g63....
-------------------- The fastest car I own is a minivan....
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Aug 12 2006, 05:33 PM
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#95
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DSMCentral Godfather Group: Admin Posts: 3,823 Joined: 10-January 01 From: Washburn Member No.: 26 |
Yes I'm looking forward to the 1/4 mile runs as well. In bench racing mode that HP & Torque should put 11.3 to 11.5's in reach.
As far as the fuel both Rob of R&T's and NCGalant are in love with BP's gas. I don't know if they have tested all the fuels in the area, but both have had bad experiences with Shell's best grade. Low HP numbers on the dyno compared to BP and alot higher knock with Shell than BP. I don't know, it may be the detergents that Shell has causing the problems because I've always heard they were of good quality. So regardless I will go out of my way to put BP in next time because I am fighting the low RPM knock still. -------------------- In Loving memory of David T Crebo
Greatness comes from the most unexpected places! |
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Aug 12 2006, 05:48 PM
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#96
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 Post Master Group: Members Posts: 626 Joined: 25-September 02 From: Urbana, IL Member No.: 19 |
I've had the best results with BP and Mobil gas as well.
-------------------- Eric Wort
87 White Buick Turbo 'T' (11.71 @ 116.5, 1.61 60ft, slipping trans) 92 Teal Eagle Talon TSi AWD (burn victim) |
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Aug 13 2006, 01:20 AM
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#97
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 DSMCentral Freak Group: Tech Moderators Posts: 388 Joined: 19-September 02 From: Pekin Member No.: 11 |
QUOTE (awd4kicks @ Aug 12 2006, 06:33 PM) I don't know, it may be the detergents that Shell has causing the problems because I've always heard they were of good quality. As far as keeping the engine clean on a daily driver I would say that shell 93(V-Power) is the best available, but as you said for high performance engines they use alot of detergents that probably aren't good for the cause. Shell 93 uses 5 times the minimum detergents that the government requires which is 3 times any other major brand currently uses. I have seen the independent study results and seen an engine dismantled after running Shell 93 and 2 other major brands (Amaco and Sunoco) that prove it. I used to manage a Freedom station that sold Shell fuel and had to go take an all day class when the V-power was introduced to the U.S. -------------------- Brian J
1996 Talon TSI AWD Great indeed is the power of the dragon as the sun, yet humbly and slowly it meanders its way shy, minuscule indeed is the power of the tiny scorpion, yet it swaggers its tail and boasts to the sky. |
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Aug 13 2006, 09:37 AM
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#98
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 Zen Master DSM Group: Moderators Posts: 3,008 Joined: 10-January 01 From: in front of you Member No.: 5 |
Awesome numbers! I'm glad she's staying together and performing so well for you. I want a ride!!
Great that you were able to free up so much hp tuning in those cams. |
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Aug 13 2006, 10:23 AM
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#99
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DSM Tech Wizard Group: Members Posts: 2,256 Joined: 10-January 01 From: central IL Member No.: 10 |
I got a ride last night.... 3rd gear, 80mph, FWD mode....
two wheels are definately not enough to keep this rocket on the ground..... -------------------- The fastest car I own is a minivan....
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Aug 13 2006, 04:28 PM
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#100
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DSMCentral Godfather Group: Admin Posts: 3,823 Joined: 10-January 01 From: Washburn Member No.: 26 |
453HP & 457ft./lb revised numbers after reviewing the graph.
Here is a graph of the best run (in blue). I have also overlaid a very similar run to help fill in the gaps (in red). It looks like the Torque peaks out at around 4900RPM and the HP maxes out between 6000 and 6500RPM. Plus you can see the HP stays above 400HP from around 4750 to nearly 7500RPM. The torque peaks early and falls, but didn't go below 300ft./lb's until after 7K RPM. Air fuel leaned out a bit up top, but still safe. All Dyno runs were started at or above 3500RPM to get away from my low RPM knock and shut off by 7500RPM. By the graphs it looks obvious that I don't need to stay in any particular gear after 6500 or 7000RPM. Shifting there will still keep me above 5000RPM and in the meat of the power. I'm pleased with this base. Thanks for the kind words.
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-------------------- In Loving memory of David T Crebo
Greatness comes from the most unexpected places! |
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